waybackexchange | 2020 Schedule + Eligibility Post

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2020 Schedule + Eligibility Post

Hi there, and welcome back! I had a fun time last year, so let's go for a second round, shall we? Below is the schedule for 2020 - modified slightly so that reveals are sliiiightly earlier.

Eligibility Review Period: January 16 - 28
Nominations: January 28 - February 11
Sign Ups: February 16 - March 1
Assignments will be sent by: March 6
Works due: April 30
Works Revealed: May 14, 9 AM MST
Authors Revealed: May 21

The pinned FAQ post, as well as the DW profile, has been updated with the 2020 schedule. Remember, for this year's round, the new cut off for fandoms is December 31, 2010. A new decade!

This post will also function as the eligibility post, for any fandoms you wish to nominate that you believe are on the line. Fandoms that were accepted last year will be automatically accepted this year, no need to make a case for those. The tagset is here if you wish to take a look.

When making your case, please include the canon's full name (as you would nominate it in the tagset), the date(s) of all the canon material that has been released, and your reasoning as to why I should accept it. Here's an example:

Ella Enchanted - Gail Carson Levine (1997)

A prequel, Ogre Enchanted, was published in 2018. While the events of Ogre take place in the same timeline/continuity, it follows a main character who did not appear in Ella. The main cast of Ogre is for the most part completely separate, apart from two characters (their identities being spoilers) who were extensively mentioned in Ella, but appeared only briefly in the original book. Therefore, I feel as if the two novels should be considered separate canons.

In cases of tie-in comics and novels, my rule of thumb is: 1. are the tie-ins well known? 2. are they by the same creators? and 3. does it clearly follow the original canon in terms of continuity/characters? If the answer is "no" to at least two of these, I won't consider them as disqualifying material. If you disagree with me about a particular judgment call, feel free to point out why - I'm not super familiar with everything, and Google can only do so much!

Lastly: you can comment here anonymously, and commenting here with your fandom does not qualify as an actual nomination. The tagset/collection for 2020 are not up yet, but I will add links to the pinned post once they are.

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Recently the Arrowverse shows did Crisis on Infinite Earths. They invited every still living DC actor back to do a cameo with their world being one of the infinite earths threatened.

The following otherwise eligible fandoms had appearances in it:
Batman (1966)
Superman (1978 – Returns)
Batman (Burton/Schumacher)
Flash (1990
Birds of Prey (2002)

Of them Batman (1966), Batman (Burton/Schumacher), and Birds of Prey (2002) only had brief cameos showing the worlds being destroyed.

Batman (1966) & Batman (Burton/Schumacher) - https://youtu.be/k54vZrbGb0Q
Birds of Prey - https://youtu.be/QLDzCqw6d8Y

The involvement of the Superman movies and 90s Flash are more substantial and plot relevant.

Edited 2020-01-16 23:17 (UTC)

I wouldn't consider brief cameos to be substantial enough to disqualify those fandoms, since it was more of a "nod" to those shows rather than actual, new canon material for those canons.

Can you elaborate on "substantial"?

I guessed that the cameos were good, but I wanted to have the evidence up since I'm considering nominating them.

For the record I'm not planning on nominating either the 90s Flash or Superman movies, but included them for completeness. I'll go ahead and do evidence for them.

90s Flash
In last year's crossover, called Elseworlds, the Monitor attacked Earth-90, the Earth of the 90s Flash. Barry fled and ended up on Earth-1. He warned CW Flash and the others about the Monitor. When he attacked the Monitor he disappeared.

He later reappeared this year for Crisis on Infinite Earths. The Anti-Monitor had captured him and was forcing him to run on a treadmill that was powering an antimatter canon that was destroying the multiverse.

Now, since season 1 of the CW Flash there had been a newspaper from the future that stated that the Flash would die on in a Crisis.

CW Flash prepares to go on the treadmill, where he would run it in reverse to destroy the canon.

However, 90s Flash instead offers to make the sacrifice. He gets back on the treadmill and runs until he dies, successfully destroying it. They show a clip from his show as he dies.

Superman
They are told they need the Paragons to save the multiverse. These are the seven greatest heroes in existence. Their search first takes them to the Smallville Earth, but that Clark isn't a paragon.

They then end up on the world of the Superman movies, with Brandon Routh resuming his role as Clark from Superman Returns (while Returns was only explicitly a sequel to 1 & 2, he also mentions the events of 3).

We find out that most of the Daily Planet staff were killed in an attack by a madman from Gotham.

The Lex Luthor from the Supergirl show followed them and uses a magic artifact to make the movie Superman fight the CW Superman. The others eventually get the book back and end the fight.

Movie Superman joins the heroes and goes to Arrowverse Earth-1. He spends the next two episodes with the heroes until the anti-matter wave hits Earth-1. In a last ditch effort the paragons are teleported away to a place outside of time.

When they get there Superman finds himself in pain. He dies in the arms of CW Supergirl. Lex then appears in his place, having used a piece of the artifact to take Superman's place as a paragon.

Later, after the multiverse is restored, we see Routh's Superman flying on his own Earth.

Okay, I think I followed all of this, lol. Things have gotten complicated since I stopped watching Arrow!

Since they seem to be explicitly continuing the story of 90s Barry Allen, and even giving him an ending, I would say that sufficiently disqualifies it. In fairness, I would probably disqualify Superman Returns, as well. But I'm open to counterarguments from anyone who would like to nominate either of these canons, since I haven't actually watched any of these shows, and so I may be missing some context.

Oh the Arrowverse has become a LOOOOOOT more complicated. Lots of awesome potential for fics, but they've added a lot more to it.

I think I found all the relevant scenes for the two characters.

90s Flash Scenes
All Elseworlds Scenes - https://youtu.be/PfKj9YhcvJg
Rescuing 90s Flash - https://youtu.be/cRFPT5Fi2Uc
Black Lighting Helps Out - https://youtu.be/T6buDad5hZk
90s Flash Dies - https://youtu.be/DYxQVq3SAhA

All Routh Superman Scenes
From Parts 2 and 3 - https://youtu.be/rOemVfXt_Y8
Multiverse Restored - https://youtu.be/F7BpkcTlzDo

The Silmarillion and other histories of Middle-Earth- J. R. R. Tolkien (1977)
The book was released in 1977. Is this eligible?

Yep!

Fullmetal Alchemist (2003) I think probably counts as a separate franchise/branch of the franchise, yeah? I just want to be Sure because it's kind of a contentious one

The 2003 anime was accepted last year, so if you wish to nominate this year as well, it would be fine.

Excellent, thank you!

What about pre-2009 seasons of Power Rangers? Sometimes they make cameos, but the comics are considered a completely separate continuity.

I'm not familiar enough with Power Rangers to know what you're referring to here. But if there's a pre 2009 season, and the characters only make cameos in comics/later seasons or movies, I'd most likely accept it.

Power Rangers is... weird. There are 26ish seasons, some of which exist in the same universe, some of which are in alternate realities, and then the two movies + comics are in completely different universes.

Starting in 1998 there's a new cast every season, and other than an occasional crossover episode and maybe an offhand mention of Power Rangers being around since Rita attacked, every season is pretty much self contained.

(It makes tagging very very difficult on AO3.)

You already accepted a few Kamen Riders, which are in a similar situation, so I just wanted to make sure! Thanks!

I have questions about a few fandoms.
Neon Genesis Evangelion: original anime ran from 1995 to 1997, manga adapting it with a changed ending from 1995 to 2014, remastered cinematic edition diverging from the original anime in the last minutes of second of three movies released so far in 2012. Is this canon eligible?
Sailor Moon - original manga 1992-1997, New anime adaptation with minor plot changes 2014-2016.
Revolutionary Girl Utena - original manga and anime 1996-2000, additional epilogue volume in 2019.
Code Geass - original anime in 2006-2008, an OVA series starring different characters in 2016, a film overriding the ending of the first season in 2019.
Additionally, what about American comics? The runs are never ending, but what if I am interested in a fanfic based on specific run?
What about Gundam? Each season/OVA series/movie/manga/novel is its own story, mostly self-contained, but as in the case of American comics about half of the stories happen in the same continuity (Universal Century), with the most recent entry still ongoing. I guess Universal Century does not apply, but do other settings?
Also, do you think it is worth asking for pretty obscure works that seem not to have an official release in English?

Edited 2020-01-28 09:00 (UTC)

Adaptations don't count as "new" material, per se, that being said - does the changed ending in 2014 affect the story/characters significantly?

Utena releasing new story in 2019 makes it ineligible, but if the new Sailor Moon is just an adaptation, then that canon would still be accepted.

If a new canon has a different set of characters, then it would count as a separate continuity. However, if the film continues the continuity of the original anime, then that would make it ineligible.

I count separate runs of comics as different canons. You can read through the FAQ for examples, or look at last year's tagset for examples of specific comic runs that I accepted.

My rule of thumb is that if the story is self contained, and has a unique cast of characters, then it would be its own canon. Taking place in the same universe doesn't mecessarily qualify it - Star Trek the Original Series, for instance, technically takes place in the same continuity as the 2009 movie - however, since the characters are significantly different and the new movies don't continue the original story, I considered them separately. You'd have to provide more detail about a specific season/OVA/etc of Gundam if you want a specific answer.

And yes, it never hurts to ask! Requests will be visible during sign ups, as will the sign up summary. What I would ask is for everyone to make sure they're offering something that at least one person is requesting, so that everyone can be assigned a recipient. For requests - if all of them are fairly rare, you might end up on the initial pinch hit list. But I try not to ask people to add more requests unless it's my very last resort.

Edited 2020-01-28 15:55 (UTC)

In case of Evangelion, anime, manga and the remake films are treated as alternate continuities, starting from the same point and slowly diverging to the point of ending up as different genres. Would it make anime continuity eligible but not manga and remake ones? The case of Code Geass is the same - the film follows the effects of alternate resolution of first season's climax, and establishes a different continuity. Does it make original anime eligible but not the alternate continuity?

If all these different iterations are self-contained, then yes I would consider them separately. That means whichever ones ended before the end of 2010 are eligible!

Hi! Would Star Trek: The Next Generation count this round, seeing as Star Trek: Picard is now airing?

Hi! I'm sorry, since Picard is a direct sequel/continuation of canon, that means TNG is no longer eligible.

Considering that only two regular characters from the TNG show appears on the Picard show, other than Seven from Voyager, I'd consider it a spin off rather than a TNG sequel.

One of whom is the main character (of both shows). We also find out where life has taken others from the original cast, and it's set in the same timeline. I'm sorry, it's pretty clearly a continuation of the original canon.

Edited 2020-01-28 23:01 (UTC)

So does that also rule out Voyager or not?

How much of Voyager's cast/storyline is set to be continued in Picard?

I have no idea, since I haven't seen any Picard & am unlikely to be able to, so I only have osmosis myself. I was just wondering whether or not it would be okay to still nom Voyager, or if Seven's appearance in it disqualified it as well as TNG.

I disqualified TNG because it seems to directly continue the story where TNG left off, sharing both characters and continuity. If Seven of Nine is the only cast member from Voyager to appear, and it doesn't directly continue the story of Voyager (hard to do, considering it ended, I guess) then I wouldn't consider that disqualifying.

As far as I know - and thank you for the answer!

Out of curiosity, what's the story ST: Picard is continuing from TNG? My knowledge is that they are actually talking about stuff happened in the movie from 2009, the Romulan star exploded making all the Romulans refugees.

I don't mean specific plot events. I mean Picard is a sequel in that it picks up in the same continuity, following the same characters. Picard, Data (or his daughter, as I understand), Riker, Troi, etc. are all the same versions of themselves as they were in TNG, no alternate universes or different timelines - they're just older. It's a grey area, I'm aware, but it seems like a fair call to honor the spirit of the exchange, which is to give fandoms that are old and "dead" a spotlight.

I haven't seen Picard and Googling can only do so much, so I'm open to arguments otherwise from those who want it in.

Noted. No, it was more a curiosity thing than an attempt to discuss the decision. But I had the impression you were watching the STP episodes, sorry for read it wrong.

No worries! I try to do as much research as I can but it's particularly difficult with a show that's new. But there's a lot of grey area, so I wanna be clear that I'm always ready to listen and reconsider!!

The L Word was my nomination last year, but I do think this year is not eligible anymore, since The L Word: Generation Q has now aired. I read other comments and it's basically the same situation as with TNG and Picard - a lot of the main cast is in both shows, and it's just a continuation of the same story 10 years later.

Thanks for letting me know! Also "The L Word: Generation Q" kinda sounds like the name of a Star Trek show, doesn't it??

LOL, omg, yes! I usually use the letter Q to mean Quentin from The Magicians, and I have seen people thinking it was Q from Star Trek too, and now I'm like "hell yeah, Q in EVERY universe!" :D :D

Is Saved By The Bell still eligible? Figured I'd check since the reboot was announced but there hasn't technically been any new material yet.

If it hasn't actually aired yet then no, I wouldn't consider that to be disqualifying. It doesn't technically exist yet, after all!

Ghost Trick: Phantom Detective

Ghost Trick's initial Japanese release date was June 19, 2010. However, it's North America/Europe/Australia release was in 2011. No new material was added or changed to the game, but because of video game release schedules the 2011 date does show up as 'date published' on some Amazon listings/reviews/etc. of the game.

I haven't been taking secondary releases into account - if it's the same game, then I'd consider its final release date as 2010.

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2020 Schedule + Eligibility Post

Arrowverse

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The Silmarillion

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